another fallen soldier. - The Smashing Pumpkins

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shamrox mod/thallium Posts: 622 Registered: Dec 2002	posted 02-05-2003 04:12 PM after almost 2 years and hundreds of songs, the smashing pumpkins song of the day website has closed its doors forever due to copywrite issues. quote: I just got an email from KODA who is caretaker of danish music copyright laws or something like that. They insinuate that I'm breaking the copyright laws by making this music available. And they want me to contact them to make an arrangement about the use of said music. I imagine they want me to pay for it. Which I can't. Since my job is basically unemployment filler. I'm not sure what the copyright laws are. And am I under Danish copyright laws if my site is located in America? And can they sue me over putting Billy's Gravity Demos up when they were given out to be spread amongst the fans like this? And if Zwan is open taping can they sue me for putting up concerts? Aiiii. I don't know. There will be no more updates until I figure out what's going. Maybe I'll have to shut down the site. I can't really afford to be sued. And I don't want to break laws either of course. I always knew there was a chance of something like this happening. But damn it this is live music, no profits are being made. I'm working my ass of out of love for Billy Corgan's music. When I got this copyright email I was in the middle of fixing the resentment problem. I had spent a couple of hours already. Time I could have spent on having an actual life or something. Agh. We'll see what happens. This could be the end of dailysp. Funny. Earlier today I ordered Zwan's Honestly single and the album too. What a bloody pirate I am, eh? I just got confirmation that if I don't want to pay for the music then I have to delete it all. This might very well be the end of dailysp. I will almost certainly have to delete the songs. Download while you can. (I should point out that I am in fact Danish. That's why a Danish organization is coming after me). UPDATE: It's over. If I want to use this music I have to pay for it. This is a non profit site, I don't have the funds to pay for anything and I don't have the personal strength to deal with this. It's been a great ride indeed and thank you to everyone who has helped me in the past. No amount of copyright lawyers can kill our love for the band. Maybe we'll meet again some time. i want to take this opportunity to thank plume for all his hard work and spreading the music. it was truly not done in vain. IP: Logged
cammie member/ghost Posts: 45 Registered: Dec 2002	posted 02-05-2003 04:17 PM awww Plume! shit that sucks.. this is a sad day. IP: Logged
tips member/ghost Posts: 536 Registered: Dec 2002	posted 02-05-2003 04:29 PM this is a black black day. IP: Logged
ceel member/ghost Posts: 603 Registered: Dec 2002	posted 02-05-2003 08:00 PM IP: Logged
shamrox mod/thallium Posts: 622 Registered: Dec 2002	posted 02-05-2003 11:19 PM quote: Originally posted by ceel: IP: Logged
Tatsuma member/ghost Posts: 3420 Registered: Dec 2002	posted 02-06-2003 02:48 AM FUCK IP: Logged
YoungWriter member/ghost Posts: 46 Registered: Dec 2002	posted 02-06-2003 03:37 AM MY guess is that that Danish record company is one of those companies that makes bootlegs (usually crappy ones at that) and sells them in record stores for +$30 marking them as import items. Somehow, they got the copyright to the, more than likely, non copyrighted music, so they got their way. Damn, this sucks. Sorry, plume. I hope you still visit the boards and all. IP: Logged
mistle member/ghost Posts: 40 Registered: Dec 2002	posted 02-06-2003 04:34 AM they're not a record company. they're just an organisation fighting for copyrights and stuff. which is fine, but i don't see how they have any fucking right to shut down the daily sp. www.koda.dk go there, mail them and call them assholes [This message has been edited by mistle (edited 02-06-2003).] IP: Logged
plume member/synthetic Posts: 22 Registered: Dec 2002	posted 02-06-2003 04:43 AM unfortunately it's worse than that. They're telling me I have to pay for the use of the music in duration of time I've made it available. So I'm probably going to be getting a nice big bill. But it's not like I had any great plans for my life anyway. ------------------ plume - stuff IP: Logged
deadSPeak member/synthetic Posts: 3 Registered: Feb 2003	posted 02-06-2003 04:51 AM When is all this shit going to stop. They were only demos and live tracks for godsake IP: Logged
evol-i member/ghost Posts: 662 Registered: Aug 2000	posted 02-06-2003 05:26 AM again, thanks to Plume for running and dedicating his time and work to this site over the last couple of years, it's been invaluable IP: Logged
evol-i member/ghost Posts: 662 Registered: Aug 2000	posted 02-06-2003 05:28 AM even the banterfiles have gone! what the fuck is that about?????? grrrrrr <e-mails stoopid danish record execs angrily> IP: Logged
starlette960 member/synthetic Posts: 21 Registered: Dec 2002	posted 02-06-2003 05:50 AM Hey plume, I just want to say thank you for everything with that site that you have done. It really sucks that they're getting you for something that seems as harmless as helping out the fans. I just wish there was something I could do to help you out in this. IP: Logged
ZERO beauty mod/thallium Posts: 1262 Registered: May 2000	posted 02-06-2003 06:19 AM quote: Originally posted by plume: unfortunately it's worse than that. They're telling me I have to pay for the use of the music in duration of time I've made it available. So I'm probably going to be getting a nice big bill. But it's not like I had any great plans for my life anyway. That's fucked up, you can probably fight them on some of it at least because most of the stuff you had was live material and demos, therefore not commercially unavilable and are not covered by the copyright laws they speak of. Maybe it's just me but there are far worse things people do everyday that are worth going after than people making music available to everyone. IP: Logged
plume member/synthetic Posts: 22 Registered: Dec 2002	posted 02-06-2003 07:41 AM quote: Originally posted by ZERO beauty: That's fucked up, you can probably fight them on some of it at least because most of the stuff you had was live material and demos, therefore not commercially unavilable and are not covered by the copyright laws they speak of. Maybe it's just me but there are far worse things people do everyday that are worth going after than people making music available to everyone. As far as I know 97% of what was on the site was live or demos. But according to mr lawyer person it doesn't matter. A live version breaks the copyright law too. I don't know if I could fight them on that. Maybe I could make a point about the gravity demos and faeomm which was given out. But at the end of the day I don't have the strength to fight. It's hard enough for me to get up and out the door every morning, I can't deal with all this. Unless there's an international millionaire super lawyer reading this board who would do it all for me for free. Anyone? Oh well. ------------------ plume - stuff IP: Logged
Queen Jeremy member/ghost Posts: 270 Registered: Dec 2002	posted 02-06-2003 11:39 AM oh this sucks monkeys... IP: Logged
Verbal Kint member/ghost Posts: 34 Registered: Jan 2003	posted 02-06-2003 11:59 AM how the fuck can they say they have the rights to stuff like 'BILLY'S' gravity demos when he gave them out i just don't understand anything anymore IP: Logged
zWANATICA member/ghost Posts: 1394 Registered: Dec 2002	posted 02-06-2003 12:02 PM Dang! Another SP site died. ...i don't think so? ~ zWANATICA IP: Logged
lpfreak1170 member/synthetic Posts: 2 Registered: Feb 2003	posted 02-06-2003 12:36 PM This truly blows. Obviously another case of the ones with the power not knowing how to use it. Thank you, Plume. Hopefully, they won't give you too much shit now that you've pulled the files. IP: Logged
plume member/synthetic Posts: 22 Registered: Dec 2002	posted 02-06-2003 01:12 PM quote: Originally posted by lpfreak1170: This truly blows. Obviously another case of the ones with the power not knowing how to use it. Thank you, Plume. Hopefully, they won't give you too much shit now that you've pulled the files. Well I've pulled the files but they're still saying I have to pay for the use of them. And pay "backwards" for the months I've used them. And since my site was up for a long time it'll probaby be a big bill. I don't know yet. ------------------ plume - stuff IP: Logged
Wish member/ghost Posts: 281 Registered: May 2000	posted 02-06-2003 01:21 PM I bet Billy will give you permission to have used them...that would make it legal... How about it admins? As far as the bill, if everyone on the board sends Plume $5 that will more than pay for it...I've certainly downloaded $5 worth of stuff... IP: Logged
I of The Everlasting member/ghost Posts: 48 Registered: Dec 2002	posted 02-06-2003 01:38 PM quote: Originally posted by Wish: As far as the bill, if everyone on the board sends Plume $5 that will more than pay for it...I've certainly downloaded $5 worth of stuff... I would do this; i can't say that I knew about your site, but us SP fans gotta stick together. What a bunch of greedy bastards they are, though. What revenue were they losting on account of your site? ------------------ "You see all those empty seats? That's not who we play for -- we play for you. I want you to remember, we won't forget you -- so don't you forget about us." [This message has been edited by I of The Everlasting (edited 02-06-2003).] IP: Logged
I of The Everlasting member/ghost Posts: 48 Registered: Dec 2002	posted 02-06-2003 02:25 PM would you want us to do that - send money (sure you would). I can't speak for the whole message board, but when you get the bill, tell us how much it comes too, and im sure we could do something. IP: Logged
shamrox mod/thallium Posts: 622 Registered: Dec 2002	posted 02-06-2003 03:54 PM quote: Originally posted by plume: It's hard enough for me to get up and out the door every morning, I can't deal with all this. Unless there's an international millionaire super lawyer reading this board who would do it all for me for free. well, i'm certainly not an international millionaire super lawyer. looks around really suspiciously IP: Logged
konehes member/synthetic Posts: 14 Registered: Feb 2003	posted 02-07-2003 01:10 AM Yes, it`s sad. Maybe Billy could do something... IP: Logged
embers of a Revolution member/ghost Posts: 34 Registered: Jul 2000	posted 02-07-2003 01:55 AM Correct me if I'm wrong... but, wouldn't the copyrights belong to either the band or virgin records? If so how can this group sue you. They have no more right to do it than say.. I do. Perhaps if you question their legality on the matter they will piss off. IP: Logged
Jean Genie, The member/ghost Posts: 90 Registered: Dec 2002	posted 02-07-2003 02:35 AM quote: Originally posted by starlette960: Hey plume, I just want to say thank you for everything with that site that you have done. It really sucks that they're getting you for something that seems as harmless as helping out the fans. I just wish there was something I could do to help you out in this. The same here. Thanks plume, you're site was great. ------------------ I just want to be me and a "fuck you" to all those who will never nderstand IP: Logged
plume member/synthetic Posts: 22 Registered: Dec 2002	posted 02-07-2003 05:07 AM quote: Originally posted by I of The Everlasting: would you want us to do that - send money (sure you would). I can't speak for the whole message board, but when you get the bill, tell us how much it comes too, and im sure we could do something. Well I'd be lying if I said I wouldn't like to get help of course. But I don't know if it's something I could or should ask. I don't know how much money it'll end up being yet either. Or if it's possible to fight it. So it's all still quite uncertain. I don't know what will happen. But I do appreciate that there are people who want to help. quote: Originally posted by embers of a Revolution: Correct me if I'm wrong... but, wouldn't the copyrights belong to either the band or virgin records? If so how can this group sue you. They have no more right to do it than say.. I do. Perhaps if you question their legality on the matter they will piss off Well the way KODA works is they get agreements with the record companies (I believe) and then they protect the record companies' copyrights. Or something like that. So Virgin has sort of handed over the rights to KODA on the Danish market. That's how I understand it anyway. I have a friend with a friend who knows some law stuff and he's looking at the emails I've gotten. Maybe they'll back off if I resist. But I don't know how much I can do that really. ------------------ plume - stuff [This message has been edited by plume (edited 02-07-2003).] IP: Logged
starlette960 member/synthetic Posts: 21 Registered: Dec 2002	posted 02-07-2003 06:38 AM quote: Originally posted by plume: Well I'd be lying if I said I wouldn't like to get help of course. But I don't know if it's something I could or should ask. I don't know how much money it'll end up being yet either. Or if it's possible to fight it. So it's all still quite uncertain. I don't know what will happen. But I do appreciate that there are people who want to help. It's really not a case of you needing to ask, I know I, and many others would be happy to try and help you out. If I don't, then I will feel that you getting screwed is partially my falt, seeing as how I have downloaded from your site many times. So let us know what we can do. You've been there for us when we wanted to hear a song, and now we should all be here for you. [This message has been edited by starlette960 (edited 02-07-2003).] IP: Logged
starlette960 member/synthetic Posts: 21 Registered: Dec 2002	posted 02-07-2003 06:40 AM [This message has been edited by starlette960 (edited 02-07-2003).] IP: Logged
Andeh member/ghost Posts: 160 Registered: Dec 2002	posted 02-07-2003 12:31 PM im with you plume, you have provided a great service, and if i can in any way i'd be happy to help, and if i can, send money (but im not rich)! IP: Logged
Frances Glass member/ghost Posts: 156 Registered: Dec 2002	posted 02-07-2003 12:35 PM fuck.....I loved that site.....I can't believe it... ------------------ ...formerly known as Eat.Pumpkins.Love.Life... IP: Logged
Sir_Denys member/synthetic Posts: 1 Registered: Feb 2003	posted 02-07-2003 09:53 PM Yo, dude. First off, material like the Gravity demos is in no way protected by ANY copyright laws. That was an informal gift by Billy himself, expressly for sharing. -Just like if your neighbour passed you a cassette of some music he played in his basement. There is no organisation that can pin you for giving those away. Second of all, I was on those KODA people's website and you might want to be careful with them. Don't believe everything they tell you. They might just be some grudgee old scrooges who are upset at the fact that music is being distributed freely. By the sounds of what is written on their site, they only have control over the live works of those artists (or their distributing companies) with whom they have legal agreements, which only makes sense. I know that not EVERYTHING you ever featured on your fabulous site fits into that criteria and, possibly, none of the Smashing Pumkins' music does! (except, perhaps, live recordings made in Denmark) Anyway, just don't give up hope quite yet, BE CAREFUL, question things, educate yourself. Hopefully it isn't too late. You've done such a great job over the past couple years... Thank you, and know that all was not lost. The music is forever out there and even KODA can't stop all those to whom YOU gave the music, from sharing it with their friends, and their friends, and theirs.... ------------------ "Soyez" Denys IP: Logged
IOfTheMourning2003 member/synthetic Posts: 1 Registered: Feb 2003	posted 02-08-2003 07:36 AM i guess we really need corgan�s word on this ! he always gave us his support to spread his music all around the world and using internet as a great device to do it....i guess if he can get to know all this he can help us more than all....him�s fans.... IP: Logged
vinylstar member/synthetic Posts: 1 Registered: Dec 2002	posted 02-08-2003 07:42 AM sorry man. chances are you'll get out of this w/o a cent out of your pocket though. i think they are trying to scare you. just dont tell them about all the shit you used to host off my machine. ~Matt IP: Logged
manhattOM member/ghost Posts: 290 Registered: Dec 2002	posted 02-08-2003 08:05 AM are you operating the site from denmark or sweden or whatever, or from the US? because if you are operating from the US, denmark is NOT going to extradite you for not paying an internet bill. the US would never let that happen. If you get a large bill from the company, contact your local ACLU. they'll help you for next to nothing. i guarantee that you won't have to pay the bill. either you'll get out of it because denmark has no juristiction here, or the o-board will raise the money for you. IP: Logged
plume member/synthetic Posts: 22 Registered: Dec 2002	posted 02-08-2003 08:31 AM quote: Originally posted by manhattOM: are you operating the site from denmark or sweden or whatever, or from the US? because if you are operating from the US, denmark is NOT going to extradite you for not paying an internet bill. the US would never let that happen. If you get a large bill from the company, contact your local ACLU. they'll help you for next to nothing. i guarantee that you won't have to pay the bill. either you'll get out of it because denmark has no juristiction here, or the o-board will raise the money for you. I'm operating it from Denmark unfortunately. I don't consider it a Danish site. The site isn't hosted in Denmark. The files aren't hosted in Denmark. The band isn't Danish. 99,99% of the visitors weren't Danish. But I am. Tough luck. I don't know what the ACLU is or if there is a Danish equivalent. I appreciate all the support. ------------------ plume - stuff IP: Logged
JustAnotherFace member/synthetic Posts: 1 Registered: Jan 2003	posted 02-08-2003 11:36 AM I'm so sorry, Plume, thank you, and I'll keep my fingers crossed... IP: Logged
deadSPeak member/synthetic Posts: 3 Registered: Feb 2003	posted 02-08-2003 12:48 PM I can only speak for myself but if the need arises I will donate some cash to you as your site has been the main site for all my pumpkins downloads... I am so sorry this has happened to you and I guess on that I speak for us all. IP: Logged
Infinite Sad member/ghost Posts: 64 Registered: Dec 2002	posted 02-08-2003 12:54 PM Commericalism of art is a horrible thing. Especially when it is done by people who did not create the artwork. Anyway, thanks Plume for all of your work, I appreciate that you have made all that great music available to the rest of us. Please tell us how it turns out. I'd be willing to help if it goes badly. You shouldn't have to pay for what you have done for us. IP: Logged

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